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Staffordshire Police welcome anti-social behaviour plans

Police in Staffordshire have welcomed the announcement of a Government training programme to help members of the public tackle anti-social behaviour in Lichfield and Burntwood.

Communities secretary John Denham has issued a rallying call for an army of community champions to challenge anti-social behaviour and pledged backing to those working to make a lasting difference.

Under the scheme, training events run in every region across England will help equip people with the confidence and know-how to join together with neighbours, police and council staff to take a stand against ASB.

Chief Supt Mick Harrison

Chief Supt Mick Harrison

Staffordshire Assistant Chief Constable Mick Harrison said:

“This further tool in the ongoing drive to rid our communities of anti-social behaviour is most welcome.

“Despite the excellent performance indicators on incident reduction and satisfaction levels in Staffordshire, the force will not become complacent. ackling anti-social behaviour is a top priority and will continue to be as it is one of the most important issues to those we serve.”

A report on the force’s approach to dealing with anti-social behaviour is set to be published by Her Majesty’s Inspectorate of Constabulary (HMIC) at the end of March. This follows a thorough and detailed review by inspectors.

ACC Harrison added:

“We are hopeful that this will continue to highlight the ongoing excellent progress and commitment in this area of policing by Staffordshire Police as we strive for professional excellence.”

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  1. Honest Citizen

    21st February, 2010 at 12:52 pm

    I am interested in how this will work.
    We see in the media if not daily certainly weekly were a concerned home owner has tried to protect their property and ended up in the legal system.
    The latest was a lone woman and four young men.She was put in crown court.
    If a lone person against four is allegedly threatening – how can we “get away with” quote ” an army of community champions to challenge ” these little darlings?

    By the way – what is the max num of red dashes issued to one posting?

  2. Andy

    21st February, 2010 at 1:49 pm

    Last year I was attacked and robbed in Lichfield and I defended myself, in the violence side of things I definately came off best. The police arrived and everyone involved was caught. I was covered in blood, none of which was mine. This ticked all the Daily Mail boxes except that I wasn’t arrested let alone charged with anything. My attackers were all charged and one of them is in jail, I ‘m sure he had a very merry Christmas. Take what you read in the media with a pinch of salt.

  3. Honest Citizen

    21st February, 2010 at 3:44 pm

    ANDY “Take what you read in the media with a pinch of salt. ”
    I do – which is why i asked the question. Perhaps the police will answer my question without the spin of the media.
    I will put it another way – if Martin/Klass were in the wrong and on their own – how will going mob (army) handed be more “legal”?

  4. Andy F

    22nd February, 2010 at 1:05 pm

    Communities being more vigilant to their local yobs can only be a good thing. I’m not suggesting violence – but zero tolerance. If people see yobs causing trouble – phone the police rather than turning a blind eye.

  5. Andy

    22nd February, 2010 at 1:12 pm

    Klass’s experience was pure spin, she asn’ charged with anything and her claim that she was warned by the police though questioned has never been verified, it’s legal rubish btw repeated by a journalist. Martin shot a man in the back trying to escape from his house, understandable perhaps but hardly justifiable. Didn’t stop it being taken up by a jouranalist or six though.

    Maybe the government should provide training to track down journalists truly the most pointless excuses for human beings loose in the country today.

  6. Honest Citizen

    22nd February, 2010 at 2:32 pm

    Andy have you phoned the police about anti soc behaviour?
    I agree communities can do some thing about it – was it not called “Neighbourhood watch”?

  7. Andy F

    23rd February, 2010 at 11:44 am

    I’ve phoned the police about “anti social behaviour”. Me and some friends once restrained a pervert who had been photographing girls in a pub toilets and benches around 3spires shopping centre.

    We caught him red handed – he proved difficult to restrain and ended up with quite a few bruises.
    The police took no action against us.

  8. Honest Citizen

    23rd February, 2010 at 12:43 pm

    Andy f – well done. What action did the police take against the other guy?

  9. Andy F

    23rd February, 2010 at 6:02 pm

    He was already  on the sex offenders register with conditions upon his movements that he had broken. I expect he got a ticking off from his social worker.

  10. Ross

    23rd February, 2010 at 9:17 pm

    “journalists truly the most pointless excuses for human beings loose in the country today”

    Thanks for that. ;o)

  11. Honest Citizen

    24th February, 2010 at 10:35 am

    “Andy F” You have confirmed what I was trying to get at.
    This person had prior crimes – the police had clear proof of breaking his probation terms/conditions ( witness’s/camera film/pictures) and still he got away with it.
    What chance does the ordinary victim stand with their word against the perpetrator?
    The police condescend to hold meetings and tell us when they are available to speak to us (some have been announced on this site) yet do not join in a debate such as this.
    We are constantly told crime is on the way down etc (Male Bovine Waste Product).
    Why then was it safe ,in yesteryear,to walk home alone,after a Fri/Sat night dancing/drinking at Mecca?
    Yet today if you even thought of walking alone at night you would be quite unwise.
    Even I am surprised that so many posters to this article have come so close and personal (witness/victim) to crime.
    We are told the Gov/Police/Council etc can monitor email/fax/phones etc so I would think it is not beyond Staffs police to keep track of postings directly relating to them.

  12. Andy F

    24th February, 2010 at 11:27 am

    “Honest citizen”
    I expect he had the book thrown at him for breaching his conditions/repeat offence – i was being humorous.
    However – the sentencing of individuals is down to Judges rather than the police – but perhaps had a light punishment – i have no idea – but this is no fault of the police.

    I think you may have miss-interpreted what this scheme is about. (I’d agree the description is rather vague).

    The scheme is more about people not turning a blind eye to crime/asb, rather than dressing up as Rorshach or Batman and delivering your own form of justice. The local community knows who are the big trouble makers – and only they can shop them.

    Unfortunatly – Anti social behaviour is punished with an ASBO – i’d agree the whole scheme is probably a waste of time and would put at risk “Do Gooders” if the criminals they act against only get a badge and certificate of merit.

    The original  need for the factories act is history repeating… makes interesting reading and explains our ‘feral youth problem’.

  13. Andy

    24th February, 2010 at 11:59 am

    4 people have posted on this article and only two have mentioned any direct experience of crime. I only posted because my experience was very different from the media peddled reality you were drawing on which I think is about as accurate as the rose tinted view of the past you have.

  14. Honest Citizen

    24th February, 2010 at 8:28 pm

    “Andy” Using your figs I think 50% (not a very scientific selection) is quite high.
    You suggest I wear pink glasses – when did you hear of the “Old Style” male copper being frightened to go on the beat on his own?
    How often in the past did they have to use “shooters”?
    Do you honestly believe it is as safe now to walk the streets at night as it was in my day?If you do – would you mind indicating your age?
    I suspect you are quite young and have only known this wild crime ridden age.
    Is there another country that bans,because of crime,a number of Olympic Games events?

    “Andy F” Perhaps this debate is bringing out our differences.I think any one who is on bail/probation and commits another crime should be locked up or at the very least have their “crime” tested in court.Personally what I would do to someone that commits crimes twice against children cannot be printed.
    In the case you mentioned – you helped the police – at the very least they should have kept you informed of what happened to the guy.
    You say the police are not at fault for the weak justice system.If the police federation/union and the chief constables collectively showed their disdain to the Gov I feel sure things would change.
    Quote”The local community knows who are the big trouble makers ” In my rose tinted days the coppers were invited into the rear of the business for a fag (that’s a smoke not the other type) and a cup of tea and a chat – they knew who the bad guys were because they were in the real world not sat at a PC looking at – you guess.
    In those days a small percentage of the population did not get on with the local copper but today the percentage is far higher.
    How many times have you seen people in a pub drink too much and drive away – how often did you your mate or anyone phone the police?
    My first comment was about the details.
    It looks like new (Male Bovine Waste Product) based on neighborhood watch and if the figs £64K allocated for the whole of staffs scheme is correct it will be a waste of cash.Recently they spent £200K in one day on a small rally!!!!
    If you have ever been into a court to see how they treat witnesses you will not be surprised why most will not repeat the experience.

  15. Andy

    25th February, 2010 at 11:41 am

    I’m 34, I like to think that’s young but I have my doubts :( This selection of 50% means nothing, half of that 50% is me and I have only posted BECAUSE I have experience.

    As for “crime ridden age” I don’ buy it there’s far to many influences on raw crime figures, the actual number of crimes being only one of them. As an example the amount of people who have home contents insurance today compared to the 1960s. If my house was burgaled I would need a crime reference number to make a claim and I would ring the police to get one. I wouldn’t phone them with any expectation of the crime being solved.

    I certainly don’t buy “coppers scared to go on the beat” and I won’t until one posts here about their experience. All you’ve got is stuff you’ve read in the media and as I’ve said before journalists are sesnationalist cretins who’ll write any old crap to get a rise. Sorry Ross, you belong to proffesion with an horrendous track record.

  16. Honest Citizen

    25th February, 2010 at 1:02 pm

    “Andy” Thanks for continuing the debate.
    I do feel sad that you and others think todays crime level is normal.
    30yrs ago in Lichfield i could and did have crates of wine delivered to my home ,week in week out,left on the door step in full view and not one was pinched also the same with groceries and milk.We have seen that today people are willing to kill for a single bottle of wine. How long would crates last if placed like that today!

    Also we never heard of drugs – today ask kids at school and they know who the dealers are!!! I would love to have coppers join in the debate – they wont because we might ask questions they do not like to answer. AND DONT THINK I HAVE NOT ASKED THEM QUESTIONS BUT ANSWERS ARE ALMOST ZERO!!

  17. Andy F

    25th February, 2010 at 3:11 pm

    “Honest Citizen”
    Crimes been with us forever – drugs have been in plentiful supply for many years. Remember Teddy Boys? Mods? Rockers? a fair few of those were on all sorts.
    Glue sniffing was rife through the 70s and 80s. As was Armed robbery and muggings.

    Don’t get me wrong here – i’m not excusing some peoples sociopathic behaviour (some people are just rotten eggs and should be hung) 

    But i reckon an increase in anti social behaviour is directly linked to poverty. (it’s undeniable).
    3 in 5 of Lichfields’ families are now low income households.
    Much higher than the national average.

    Not sure who to blame for that? the District Council? The Government? GKN? Commuters from London pushing up the housing costs? Not enough affordable housing built next to railway tracks and bypasses?

  18. Andy

    25th February, 2010 at 4:30 pm

    I’m sorry, even though I actually have been attacked and robbed I can’t bring myself to be as suspicious/fearful of the people around me as you are. The vast majority of people are ok, they don’t want to rob you or hurt you, lighten up. As for your view of the past you must have heard of the famous blitz spirit in London? Crime rates doubled and armed robbedry was out of control but hey, it was in the past so it must have been good right?

  19. Andy

    25th February, 2010 at 4:32 pm

    oh dear, my comments now seem to have to be moderated before they appear which is unfortunate so this will be my last one

  20. Honest Citizen

    26th February, 2010 at 11:54 am

    Andy I agree most people are still honest.Lichfield is still a nice place and one of the best in the UK BUT it is not as nice as it once was.
    We did not need CCTV only places like jewelers had security.Now supermarkets have to have CCTV watching the coffee!
    Two things you said made me laugh.
    Poverty in Lichfield you do not know the meaning of the word as I understand it.To me poverty was one egg between 4 children for the days meal – FACT.
    Have I heard of the BLITZ – to you it may have been a history lesson – to me it was current affairs.

    Crime in the war – with people on the bread line as you can not imagine – if/when the little corner shop was bombed with what small amount of food in it blown over the road along with body debris – did you think they would just leave it there to rot!
    The shops had less in them than most people buy today for their weekly shop.

    We have just had a light dusting of snow and England all but came to a standstill.
    Did the schools etc close when ,in the past,we had realy deep snow !

    If you know any one that lived in a city during that time – ask them which was the worst group of people for tea leafing.

    It has been nice chating to you -all the best.

  21. Andy F

    26th February, 2010 at 6:38 pm

    It looks like we’ll have to wait till march for the report and how its going to be implemented.

    As for poverty – the U.K statistics office only publishes figures for  “Low income families” (income less than 12k per year). Im sure in lichfield it was 3/5 or 4/5 second quarter last year – but i can no longer find the statistics.

    The above leaflet breifly admits housing problems in lichfield – not affording a roof over your head is certainly poverty – especially as we are not at war with Nazi germany during which you could understand poverty occuring in one of the worlds richest nations – and having to make do with powdered egg.

    The leaflet says “Hard working families cannot access the housing they need”
    “Homelessness and overcrowding are a reality for lichfield residents”

    To me – thats poverty.

    Perhaps we’ll speak again in March.

  22. Honest Citizen

    27th February, 2010 at 1:49 am

    I would need to know a bit more of why they are “overcrowding” before I agree it is due to poverty!
    Too many kids is not due to poverty but is due to career choice all too often.
    I have no doubt people want to live in millionaires row and can not afford it – I see TODAY there are houses in staffs circa £30K.
    There is also cash to help pay rent if you work and even more cash if you do not work.
    This is a small island – people need to get used to the fact not every one can have a big house – we already have too many people on it.
    I do not know anyone that the word poverty applies to in Lichfield.
    If you do please lets have details – not their name/add – but the other details so we can see their plight.
    Who knows – someone may be able to help.

  23. Andy F

    27th February, 2010 at 4:42 am
    The link above is a PDF document of the “Local area Delivery Plan” for Lichfield District 2007/2008 (pre recession of course).It says the North Lichfield area (chadsmead, curborough and Stowe) have a particularly acute need in relation to Child Poverty.
    It goes on to state that Chadsmead and Chasetown areas are amongst the poorest wards in the Country (not county – but Country) in terms of multiple depravation.It also states that crime levels in Chasetown and north Lichfield are higher than other areas of the district.The number of residents over 60 is growing at ten times the national rate – i expect the pied piper is taking the kids away rather than they can’t afford to live here – or perhaps they have moved to those £30k houses you mention.(information in the document is taken from ‘Indices of DEPRIVATION 2004 and Profiling Staffordshire- Lichfield District Research Unit, DSD, Staffs County Council)
    Overcrowding is caused by a housing shortage – which pushes up the cost of housing and therefore can increase instances of poverty.Currently in this weeks mercury is a story of Government intervention to get enough houses built here – the District Council don’t seem to think there is a shortage either. Perhaps you could stand in the next elections – you’d fit in well.
    I’m not attempting to paint a bad picture of  LIchfield – merely suggesting that crime is perhaps linked to economics.And this new Community scheme is only dealing with the symptoms and not the cause.
    I hope this information has helped – i agree that we don’t need to post peoples names and addresses when we have bona-fide government documents with the relevant information. 
    I’m glad to have helped give you a reality check.

  24. Honest Citizen

    27th February, 2010 at 3:11 pm

    The areas you mention have some very nice people living in them.
    You can often tell where the other type live just by driving down the road and their houses stand out -for the wrong reasons.
    We do not need more homes we need the people to move into houses that already exist.
    In Stow,for example,we have just (soon?)given away a building ,in a residential area,to be used for business purposes which could quite easily be used for accommodation.
    In the other wards there is overcrowding but that is not due to poverty it is due to generations of people breeding uncontrollably because it is easier than working.
    In the areas you mention these “poor” people often have a greater income than MOST of the shop workers in the town centre.

    You mention reality check which is why I asked for details which have not been forthcoming!
    I have seen up close people who are genuinely deprived in other areas such as London/Birmingham where they sleep in hedge or doorway but I have not heard or seen such groups in Lichfield.Even x cons have a nice warm bed.
    Lets quote from the doc you mention to make it simpler.

    Quote “The teenage conception rate in Chadsmead, Curborough and Boney Hay exceeds
    the national average” – they do not need more money they need to cross their legs.

    Quote “Chadsmead, Boney Hay and Chasetown wards all have Economic Activity rates
    below the national average.” – You did know that’s code for more are unemployable! Stop the scroungers handouts and they will find work.

    Quote “Lichfield is the least deprived district in Staffordshire. Quality of life is good, with
    generally high levels of educational attainment, low rates of crime and good levels of
    health.” The best place to be born in BUT only if the parents show the correct guidance.The type you refer to KNOW there is no need to work in England today.

    Quote “The wards of Chadsmead, Curborough, Chasetown and Boney Hay have some of
    the lowest attainment figures for education, skills and training in the country.” See above – no need to learn a skill or work.

    Quote “Crime levels are higher in North Lichfield and Chasetown than other areas of the
    district.” No punishment so the bad guys can only gain.If we are short of property we must prioritize – the most needy/deserving should get the first choice.
    We must have lots of spare houses as most/all of the bad guys including drug dealers have social family homes.

    You mention kids are moving away – that’s good they need to see the world – but I see not sign of it in the real world.
    When I go into town I see it crowded all day with moms and kids.Go into any store – kids – kids – kids.
    Parking is a major problem during the day – presumably with those unemployed poor people drinking £3 cup of coffee.

    I must add here that there are a lot today who are trying to get jobs and they will work again – the other type have generations of scroungers that have never worked

    Thanks for the vote/suggestion for councilor – unfortunately my community/voluntary days have long since past.

  25. Andy F

    27th February, 2010 at 3:42 pm

    Earlier you were Saying how “Lichfield has gone downhill” – and then you declare statistical evidence that supports your claims as Bunk.

    You give lowly opinions of people who are the victims of a poorly managed local economy – just after saying there’s good people here.

    “Stop the scroungers handouts and they will find work”…
    Of course…. 
    Industry being moved abroad for cheap third world labour is entirely fictional.
    23,500 people in January this year all decided to sign on the Dole – Factory bosses are baffled by this.

    GKN Lichfield which closed whilst being in profit had to move the factory to another country.
    A GKN spokesman said “I’d never seen anything like it. All they wanted to do was drink special brew and impregnate single mothers”

    The average house price in lichfield being £242,000 has no bearing upon remaining disposable income in the town. The Hardworking shop owners were probably lying when they told you they were’nt making much money. They must be rolling in it during the biggest recession in most of our lifetimes.

    I’ve changed my mind – all is well – i can’t understand why you were saying Lichfield has gone down hill.

  26. Andy F

    27th February, 2010 at 3:47 pm

    I just received an email suggesting that people are at the mercy depending upon where capital investment occurs.

    Of course me and Honest Citizen knows this to be unture – lazy people get what they deserve – and if kids are in poverty – so what – thier mothers should have kept thier legs closed.

  27. Dean F (Independant)

    28th February, 2010 at 12:13 am

    Great another unworkable idea by the Labour government, i did not ever begin to think it was the PUBLICS responsibility to tackle anti social behaviour. Ask the question why is there anti social behaviour ??? Not how we should alleviate it by banging people up making them more angry !!!

    Why dont the government initiate schemes which cost very little money such as organising sports tournaments, getting rid of the late licenses, cracking down on petty drugs in Lichfield such as cannabis and more importantly providing better educational facilities in Lichfield, not all children want to sit with a pen !!!!

  28. Andy F

    28th February, 2010 at 1:57 pm

    Dean F has the right sense of direction. 

    Making efforts in the direction of those who want to achieve – rather than pointing blame at a small minority of ne’er do wells is certainly a better thing to do.

    “Lead by example” i think they call it.